You can listen to the second episode with Anka Lavriv here. Or you can view the footage of this interview on YouTube with English subtitles/closed captions here.
NOT JUST A GIRL: Tattoo Podcast
EPISODE TRANSCRIPT
Season 1, Episode 2: New York
Eddy: [00:00:00] Hello friends. Welcome to not just to go the tattoo podcast where every week I will speak to socially conscious tattooers about their lives and art practice through an intersectional feminist lens. I'm Eddy and thank you for joining me for the second episode. Today we'll be discussing adapting to social change, meditation and self discovery in art and building a community around the tattoo studio.
Before we begin, I would like to acknowledge the Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander people. Who are the traditional custodians of this land that was stolen and never ceded. I'm honored to be on the ancestral land of the Awabakal people where this podcast is recorded and produced. I pay my respects to the elders past and present and extend my recognition to their descendants.
[00:01:00] I am so excited to introduce today's guest Anka Lavriv. Um, she's incredibly talented and is the co owner of Black Iris in Brooklyn. Um, her ethereal illustrative, um, tattoos are magical and her approach to her practice is absolutely beautiful. I had the great pleasure of meeting Anka when I guested it in his studio last year, and thank you so much for joining me today.
Anka: [00:01:39] Thank you so much for inviting me. I'm so excited about it. I'm so psyched to see you. Um, cause we were supposed to be hanging out right around this happened, so sad.
Eddy: [00:01:52] I'm so sad I missed out. I wanted to try and get tattooed by you and hang out and
Anka: [00:01:59] It was good [00:02:00] to at least see you on here.
Eddy: [00:02:02] Yeah, yeah, definitely. So like. Obviously you're in the epicenter of the pandemic in the US um, how are you going and how has the studio going?
Anka: [00:02:15] It's been like such an up and down experience. I don't know. We're kind of taking it one day at a time, you know? Um, I. Personally thought that I was going to be handling this crisis better than I am. And that was kind of like a humbling experience for me. Cause I'm always like, I'm so good in crisis. Like, you know, I figure it out and um, this really like knocked me on my ass. I was, especially the first couple of weeks I like right when we got locked out. We, um, got Corona and it was like such a horrible experience.
So when my fever broke and I came back [00:03:00] to reality, I was like, everything hit me at the same time. I just like had a complete melt down and. Yeah, it's been, ever since it's been like one day I'm just like, everything's great. Like we're going to figure it out. Like world is going to be a better place, and the next day I'm just like we're fucked.
Eddy: [00:03:24] It's all part of the grieving process though. Hey, like it's completely new and you've had everything kind of ripped away from you, like the world that we know and yeah, there's definitely like processing the loss. Like it's, it's, it would be weird, if we would just all okay with it.
Anka: [00:03:42] Yeah. It's just, I feel like for everyone this time is bringing up like the deepest oldest trauma and fears and, you know, all of this stuff is surfacing and hopefully we can deal with it finally. [00:04:00] Cause. Chances are we never properly dealt with it and recognized it and like, you know, ascended from, hopefully... it's been an experience for sure. Being here and just like seeing these images of New York empty and, you know, going to the grocery store and seeing all the businesses close, like the empty neighborhoods, people wearing masks. It's just like such a, such a strange sight.
Eddy: [00:04:36] Yeah. It's definitely not what you imagine the year is going to be. And then it's also just not what you imagine. Like how we react to things like, I dunno, I didn't think this was ever something I considered as being a possibility.
Anka: [00:04:53] No, it's, it's wild. Um, I'm convinced that by the end of 2020, uh, the [00:05:00] aliens will attck a hundred percent sure seems like a logical conclusion to 2020.
Eddy: [00:05:10] Shits just gone out of control.
Anka: [00:05:14] Yeah. Like who would have ever thought that all the like traveling will stop?
Eddy: [00:05:20] Yeah.
Anka: [00:05:20] Just that. Was such a such a part of everyone's life, like, yeah, it's wherever you look. You know? The changes are just so wild.
Eddy: [00:05:35] Yeah. It's, it's, it's funny you were talking about like how this experience is an opportunity to heal because I remember you posting on Instagram, I think it was before all this, how you wanted to like explore your art, making more and do more healing through that. And then all of this has just happened,
Anka: [00:05:57] Like not to make this about myself, but [00:06:00] this is like the perfect illustration of my whole life. I'm just like, let me do this thing. And then I just like get swept away in a tornado.
Sorry thats not what I meant. So I turned 33. Last year and for for this year for me was like, I was like, that's it. Like I woke up in the morning, I always tried to go somewhere where I can be around like a big body of water for my birthday and I wake up early, I go to see the sunset and like set intentions for the year, and I was like, this year I'm like, shedding all the llike skin and things that are untrue things that don't belong to me. Like I want to get back to like who I really am. And you know, it was like the universe definitely heard me.
It's been a lot of [00:07:00] shedding for sure. Um, but this was like such a, i feel like. It's been such a culmination of this because I, I've never in my life had an opportunity to just be and live and not do anything and stop like in my adult life, like never ever. So it's been a lot of thinking, a lot of reading, a lot of like writing, putting things together because, I don't know, I just feel like we all took a like a hard look at our lives and I don't know, for me, like being able to step away from my like daily routine and the hamster wheel and just like, you know, more rents, more money, more expenses, and just be like. What do you really want? Like how do you see your ideal existence?
Like what are you [00:08:00] chasing? Why are you so like obsessed with like doing more and more and more like. I don't know, it like really revealed so much for me personally, even though it's been very painful.
Eddy: [00:08:12] Yeah. I feel like, I mean, even though my situation in Australia is much easier than what you're experiencing in the US like its very much the same here, like an opportunity to really, you know, while I have the privilege of a comfortable home and food on the table and all of that, like I can really just like shed my expectations and reassess what's important to me and kind of discover a new way of life that's more comfortable and more healthy and that is not going to end up with me in agony and unable to work in 10 years time.
Anka: [00:08:47] Yeah. Yeah, because it's just like, it's just a part of, you know, this culture, the hostile culture, and just like, you have to do more and, you know, [00:09:00] never sleep. Never rest. Just like go, go, go, go. And like, that's not how life works. Like you have to. You have to go through the cycles, you have to give and you have to receive and you have to like be awake and then goes to sleep. Like just
Eddy: [00:09:16] Absolutely its very toxic like this way of life I've become accustomed to. And I think for me, like just sitting at home with my cats and watching them, like they do things when they want to. They rest when they need to. They eat if they're hungry. I was just kinda like, why can't, I know its stupid, but why can't I live like a cat?
Anka: [00:09:36] That's so funny you said that because I was thinking the same thing. I was like, no. When you scratch them and they don't want to be scratched anymore, they just turn away from you. They're like, I'm done. I do not enjoy that im leaving.
So it's been really eye opening for me. I, you [00:10:00] know, I was supposed to go to back home for a while and my sister and I were planned this whole trip. We were supposed to go to Budapest and like do all this cool stuff. Like I spend one week with my sister in the past 14 years.
Eddy: [00:10:18] Wow.
Anka: [00:10:19] So I was really looking forward to it, and it was so heartbreaking to just like cancel everything, but
Eddy: [00:10:29] Oh, I'm so sorry. That would have been hard.
Anka: [00:10:32] Yeah. And the other thing is the crap with immigration. You know, it's just like doing all this stuff with green cards, but it's, again, you know, it's, it's making me think maybe its not, you know, I'm not meant to live here for forever. Yeah. I don't know. Yeah.
Eddy: [00:10:52] Things might change, you never know.
Anka: [00:10:55] I hope so. Yeah. I really hope so.
Eddy: [00:10:58] Yeah. So will [00:11:00] you, for our listeners, like you were born and grew up in Ukraine? Um, yeah. And that like must have really impacted how you experience life, especially in the US like having such a different background and also like being more adaptable and stuff. Cause you mentioned that you did experience poverty as a child as well.
Anka: [00:11:24] So I was born like three years, four years before Soviet union, disassembled. And you know. I actually like talking to my parents helped me a lot to deal with what's going on right now because they were in the situation where they had like two youngkids. They're everything they knew in life, just like broke and you know the belief system, the like just, it just collapsed and they had to [00:12:00] pick up the pieces.
Like. You know, all I remember from my childhood is like standing in line with my mom all the time for like to buy bread or like milk or whatever. Yeah. And we didn't have money for a couple of years because you know, the Soviet currency was obviously done, but we didn't have our own currency. So we had these, like the temporary money that was called coupons, and like a loaf of bread costs like 2 million coupons. It was just like, so insane.
Eddy: [00:12:38] That is insane
Anka: [00:12:40] Yeah.
Eddy: [00:12:41] It must be confronting like seeing people complaining about not being able to go to a hairdresser when you're like, um, I couldn't buy bread.
Anka: [00:12:49] Yeah. So, but, you know, it's like I didn't know any other way of life, so it was just like, and honestly, like most people were in the same boat. Um, but. [00:13:00] I find it so interesting that, you know, like in Soviet union it was all about kind of, you know, theoretically it was about equality and everyone having the same amount. And, and then once it all collapsed, it was just complete madness. Like people were just like murdering each other for money and yeah, it was like, yeah, human nature, like
Eddy: [00:13:26] Humans.
Anka: [00:13:28] It comes through no matter what. Um, yeah, but. It is very, it's very different here. It took me a while to get used to it. I've always loved New York and I don't think that I would have stayed here if I wasn't in New York. Cause when I first moved to US, I was in ocean city, Maryland and it wasn't my favorite place, it was a strange place to be [00:14:00] when you first get here.
Um, but then they came to me. I was supposed to go home and I came to New York for two weeks to see a friend, and I was like, I'm not going anywhere. And went and threw my tickets and stayed. And like, that's the shit that you do when you're 19.
Eddy: [00:14:23] It seems like such an amazing city to be in though if you are creative because of the possibilities around you and like all of the different cultures coming together and just the art world in general is really, it seems to be really celebrated there.
Anka: [00:14:38] The diversity like was so it was like my favorite thing because I did not experience that at home at all. But like now things are different, but not when I was growing up, it was just. You know, we had like people from peace Corps come and like we were like all going at them, like wow [00:15:00] Americans such a such a site. Yeah. So I really do appreciate this aspect of living here. And just. I dunno. I felt like, and I still do sometimes when I go places like you feel though kind of the wall of people treating you differently when you're from somewhere else. And in New York, I, I never really experienced that because everyone's pretty much from somewhere else.
And like I worked at a Mexican restaurant for many years and it was just like. You know, so many different people from so many backgrounds and everyone is just like getting along and doing this crazy thing like this, you know, high pressure, like really weird and nothing like being a bartender in New York [00:16:00] city. It was like a bootcamp of life
Eddy: [00:16:06] That's such a good way to put it. That's what I found fascinating about New York as well, because I live in quite a small city in Australia and it's very like working class white like. You know, we're a bunch of colonizers here and there's not a lot of diversity. And yeah. So when I came to New York and I was hearing all of these different languages and seeing all of this different cultural dress as well, being adapted into modern fashion, and it was fucking amazing and beautiful and fascinating. And also like seeing the museums and galleries having more diversity in like what they were displaying as well, rather than just everything by old white men.
Anka: [00:16:48] I got here and I was like, how am I supposed to like un-see this and unexperience this and just go back to like the same old lifestyle? I was like, I can't, I'm corrupted [00:17:00] right now. I can not leave. I remember the moment when I was walking on the Brooklyn bridge for the first time and I was like. That's it. Like I can't do anything about this. Like I have to stay here.
Eddy: [00:17:17] That's so good. Did you start tattooing in New York?
Anka: [00:17:21] I just started tattooing back home, actually. I started tattooing when I was 15
Eddy: [00:17:26] Oh wow.
Anka: [00:17:28] I always have been like obsessed with the idea and I really don't remember where I got the the idea in my head because that's not something I was around. It's not something that was like very developed at the time where I'm from and I just had these like little flash sheets and I would like draw on my friends and my neighborhood and then like.
When I turned 15 my dad was like, okay, you have to like stop asking me [00:18:00] for money and you have to go get a job. Like, what do you want to do? And I was like, I want to be a tattoo artist. And like, my dad asked his friend to teach me how to, yeah. Like I didn't appreciate it at the time, you know? And now I'm just like, this is really cool.
Eddy: [00:18:17] Thats awesome
Anka: [00:18:20] And, uh, like. I talked to so many clients who are like oh man and I'm like almost 40 and my mom still doesn't know I have tattoos and I'm just like, that makes me really appreciate like how cool my parents were.
Eddy: [00:18:40] That's so cool,
Anka: [00:18:42] Yeah. So I got my apprenticeship. I like literally my first day ever of my apprenticeship. I was supposed to just sit there and watch the guy and like, you know, clean the studio and stuff and his client didn't show up. And the guy [00:19:00] was like, all right, get, take the machine and like, go over my old tattoo. Like I have never seen a tattoo machine in real life. Like,
Eddy: [00:19:10] Wow
Anka: [00:19:10] I, completely blacked out. Like I just don't remember anything about it. The first day of my apprenticeship
Eddy: [00:19:21] That is amazing.
Anka: [00:19:23] It was like, you know, we were like soldering needles, like it was very, very different. And I'm sure it was very unsanitary because they had some like autoclaves, but they were like a million years old. Yeah.
Eddy: [00:19:41] That's really cool that you got to experience, I guess, that old world of tattooing like,
Anka: [00:19:47] Yeah.
Eddy: [00:19:48] Before this, like new age brought in by social media where everything's kind of changed and you just buy things in packets now and like, actually the person was smoldering needles. I've only done it once, but it's really [00:20:00] incredible.
Anka: [00:20:01] And, um, we went to get me a license to some guy's place and he was like, you know, it's gonna be this much money. And like, I gave him the money and he just like, wrote this like license for me. Like completed this training. It was just like everything was just such bullshit because it was a very different in Ukraine and yeah you can pretty much buy yoursef whatever you want, definitely a very unconventional story.
Eddy: [00:20:42] I love it
Anka: [00:20:43] But then we're like, I started college and I was like practicing on all my college friends and yeah. And then I moved here and I fell out [00:21:00] of it for a long time cause it was, you know, things are a little different here. Yeah. So, you know, it took me a while to get back to it. Like a long while, but I, I've always drawn, I always made art work and I actually started showing around Brooklyn, Manhattan and like getting invited into like a bunch of art shows and that's how people were like well, you know, she can draw, so how bad can she be at tattooing? And they was like, let me practice on them.
Eddy: [00:21:37] That's awesome. It's cool that you had the opportunity to establish yourself as an artist first. Like I think that that sometimes gives you a much stronger foundation to build a career upon. Like
Anka: [00:21:49] I still think that I still, like for me, I'm an artist first. And tattooing is just like a medium and like a way [00:22:00] of life that I'm super grateful for, but it's kind of always like second for me.
Eddy: [00:22:08] Yeah. I think that. That's a good thing in a lot of ways though, because that means your focus is on good design and beautiful art rather than making money. Sometimes people who are just tattooers by trade, like their focus is so different,
Anka: [00:22:25] But like even saying this, like making me sweaty, somebody is listening. But if its how I feel. Trying to be honest.
Eddy: [00:22:43] I had, um, how did you come to the point where you were using, like the imagery you use its like, it's very powerful, like you see a lot of goddesses represented in your work and stuff. Is that like a cultural thing or is that a personal thing? Like what's kind of [00:23:00] informed that subject matter.
Anka: [00:23:02] So it's definitely a personal thing. And, um, I usually, like, my process is usually like when I work on like bigger drawings is that like, I get the imagery from, from meditation basically. And I just get these kind of like flashing images of like how the layout is going to be and I like quickly draw it out. And at this point I kind of, you know, and I, I just know that like, if I try to like come up with something, it just, it doesn't feel right.
But when I, like when it comes to me, like it's always super smooth the process of like putting it out there. So, yeah, I do a lot of meditation and it like absolutely changed my life for so much better in every possible way and just kind of [00:24:00] like tuning into this, like, I don't want to say channeling because it's not channeling, but it's just like letting letting the process come to you versus like trying to squeeze something out because I'm sure every artist can relate to the feeling of, you know, being like come on, let's, let's create something awesome and you're just sitting there frustrated at the white page.
Eddy: [00:24:30] Absolutely, it probably what makes your work so unique and authentic? The fact that it. Literally just flowing from you and you just, you're just like this vessel to like express whatever's coming through you and you're giving it a space. That's, that's like very powerful.
Anka: [00:24:49] It took a really long time to like tune into it because I I have like a complex of like, Oh, I don't have art education. [00:25:00] So I felt like really inferior for like imposter syndrome as we always, like, we all have, I'm sure. Um, and I would look at my work that looked like my work and I didn't want it to look like my work. I wanted it to look like something that I thought was better and I would just like get so frustrated.
Like, why? Why is it like this? Like why does it look like this? And until I started appreciating that, like, you know, this is how you do it. Like you can change it. You can try different ways where you always go back to that specific style. Um, like things got so much better for me.
Eddy: [00:25:48] Yeah. Oh, that's awesome. Cause I've always been like a big believer in, if you just do what feels right for you and what feels natural then there's the space for everyone. Like we don't have to [00:26:00] compete, and you just get to be yourself and you get to enjoy the process of art making more and it it contributes in a much more positive way to the world.
Anka: [00:26:09] But I think to get to that, to be able to just let this expression fully come, like you have to work through so much, so much to learn and
Eddy: [00:26:20] That's something I struggle with
Anka: [00:26:22] So many layers of crap and like capitalistic shit. And you know, it's like I've only gotten there through doing like really a huge amount of inner work.
Eddy: [00:26:36] Yeah. Cause we're conditioned to hate ourselves and to be numb so that we just follow and do what we're told. But actually like acknowledging yourself and looking at how you feel and processing it, that is a very difficult thing to do.
Anka: [00:26:51] Yeah. And I like have been pretty like, you know, in hindsight, like I look back at my life and I'm just like. Whoa, [00:27:00] you really did whatever you wanted then. You know? Like when I was like, I'm staying here, and my parents were like, what are you talking about? Like you are 19 years old, just turned 19 like you don't have any money or any friends. Like, and that was just like, no, I feel it in my gut that I like, this is where I have to be.
And you know, you do a lot of this and like some of the decisions look very like bad at the moment, but over time you're like, Whoa, like really kind of, I don't even know what I'm trying to say, but I'm trying to say that like I've kind of trained myself to follow like that instinct, you know, when you just feel like something is right and like you have to act on it. Like even though it looks. Like kind of crazy.
Eddy: [00:27:58] Yeah. That's awesome.
[00:28:00] Anka: [00:28:00] And I think it's same thing in, in like following your voice in any kind of artwork.
Eddy: [00:28:07] Yeah, yeah, yeah. And you, I mean, you take that kind of approach with your customers as well. Like your whole process is very like, I guess, spiritual or ritualistic like, so to speak, like, um, you know, how do you, how do you go about like, giving your customers an experience like, like that where they're able to help channel themselves into what they're getting tattooed by you?
Anka: [00:28:36] I think like our job is such a unique opportunity to connect with people on like such deep level, like right off the bat. Sometimes I like to ease the tension I like sometimes talk to people about how absurd this is that you like, come to someone that you've never met and you were like, hi, nice to meet you. Like I'm going to shave you now [00:29:00] poke you with needles for awhile and then you'll pay me or it
Eddy: [00:29:07] Next level.
Anka: [00:29:09] It's crazy. And like sometimes I just block it out because when you start thinking about it, it's it's unbelievable. Truly, you know, but I, I'm so happy that I get to do this because the genuine experiences that you have with people is like nothing else I can think of.
Eddy: [00:29:33] Yeah.
Anka: [00:29:33] And you know, people just like tell you. Things that are so personal, and I'm actually like, I hate small talk. I was a bartender for 10 years and I had to do so much small talk that I just cannot even, I can't, I cannot stand being like the weather is good.
Eddy: [00:29:58] Get to the deep stuff, Tell [00:30:00] me what your soul says
Anka: [00:30:02] Like. I do not mind. When people will share like really personal stuff with me. Like, you know, it goes into like another territory where you have to set boundaries for yourself. Because I started getting to the point where I was like, I, I love connecting with my clients. I love talking about the deep stuff. But at the end of the day, I feel like I got run over by the truck and because I am an empathetic person and I like really take everything to heart. And I didn't even realize how much it like built up in me until this time where we can just like sit home and donothing and think about our lives. And I was like, wow. Like I didn't realize how tired I was. And like, not so much so [00:31:00] physically, but. Emotionally.
Eddy: [00:31:02] Yeah.
Anka: [00:31:04] Like sometimes just sit here and like stare at the wall for like an hour and then like, I dunno, it's just like hits me like the level of of exhaustion that was there and I didn't even know.
Eddy: [00:31:20] We do so much emotional labor in our tattooing that like it does, it does take a huge hit. Like on our bodies.
Anka: [00:31:31] It's the trap where you're like, well, you know, I love what I do. I love my clients. I love, and you feel guilty admitting to yourself that like, maybe I need help or maybe I need rest. And you just like keep calling yourself. Oh, well you're just being ungrateful. Or you know, whatever. You were like being a brat. Like at least I do that. And you know, I worked enough shitty jobs for [00:32:00] years that just like made me hate my life, be so depressed and like I just never wanted to do anything else. Like, honestly, I try not like a huge broad spectrum of jobs, but like, enough different fields to just like say, I don't want to do anything else.
Eddy: [00:32:23] Yeah. Yeah. I'm the same. I think when you're a creative, like and you're not doing something that's in that ballpark. It's life is very miserable.
Anka: [00:32:34] Yeah. But then you know, you have to find a way to like recognize that you're a person too, and sometimes you need a break and. Like, I'm so amazed that like, you know, we have so many guests now and meeting a couple of people who are truly like, yeah, you know, I go and they work for like a month and then I [00:33:00] go away for three months and I rest. Its a dream
Eddy: [00:33:06] It doesn't occur to you that that's actually a possibility and that it's okay to rest.
Anka: [00:33:11] Like, why not? You know, we like this, this illusion that we're not in control of our lives and our schedules, like I still have the mindset of working for someone, even though I'm working for myself, and I always used to say like if I worked for myself, I would be so chilling all the time. And I'm like, I'm the meanest boss I've ever had. It's just like. Maybe it's time to look like what's beneath this, like, you know?
Eddy: [00:33:55] Yeah.
Anka: [00:33:56] And just like do learn to be kinder to ourselves. [00:34:00] I don't know,
Eddy: [00:34:04] Theres a lot of things to unlearn there.
Anka: [00:34:08] And for me personally, when I'm not kind to myself and the like overworked and cranky. And when someone's complaining about it, I'm like, Oh, whatever. Like you don't need to work that hard. You know? Like I stop myself and I'm like, Oh, like talking, like who's saying those things
Eddy: [00:34:30] We, we do start to judge other people through that nasty lens that like we apply to our own lives and it's very, very toxic and
Anka: [00:34:40] Yeah. How much have you produced?
Eddy: [00:34:45] Yeah. I hate that. Like we don't have to produce anything. It's okay to sit on your ass like there's other ways to contribute to society as well. I think just kindness and love and there's [00:35:00] other ways to contribute without having to make money and
Anka: [00:35:03] Yeah
Eddy: [00:35:04] Like working.
Anka: [00:35:06] Yeah. And I've been, I've had so many realizations during this time, you know, on like what really drives me here. And i, you know, like if it's not oversharing, I have been sober for four and a half years now, and that is something that I never thought that I was going to be able to pull off.
Eddy: [00:35:33] That's amazing.
Anka: [00:35:35] Thank you. Um, so proud, cause you know, it's been like a really, really long road for me and changed my life completely. But it was so much stuff was not processed and it's still not, and just like when [00:36:00] you live your life a certain way and then you can't do your usual coping mechanism anymore, like lots of things come up and you react to things in a way where you just like explode over, nothing, you know? And you're just like, what am I doing this?
And it's, it's just because you, you don't have your crutch anymore. You can't, you know, you can't just like check out or numb out. You have to actually go through the painful experiences. And I've been having like a lot of things from like the residue from that come up in this time. And just like the way I'm able to deal with things as a sober person is so much better.
Eddy: [00:36:53] That's amazing.
Anka: [00:36:54] And again, you know, just like meditating on things and being able [00:37:00] to separate yourself from like this part of you that's like freaking out and being able to. Like almost have a conversation with it and be like, what do you need? You know, what are you missing right now? Like what? What really is the problem? It's not really that email thats making you jump out of your skin.
Eddy: [00:37:22] That like internal self-parenting where you've just got to calm yourself down and be like it's ok, what's the next thing
Anka: [00:37:30] With dealing with clients so much? Cause I, I used to, like when I first started, I would like let myself get like, cranky with someone if they would, you know, not act the way I wanted. And, uh, yeah. So the past couple of years, my view on it changed so much and I'm just like. You do what you need to do. If someone's driving you [00:38:00] crazy, you go to the bathroom, scream in the roll of toilet paper.
But like because this, like, I feel like when you get tattooed, like it's such a hyper hightened experience. It's such a like hightened state. You have to be so aware of what you're saying, how you're acting, because like the smallest thing that's so insignificant to, you can set someone off like set off their, their past trauma or you know, you just have to be so careful. And then that's all they remember about their experience, no matter how amazing the tattoo is.
Eddy: [00:38:43] Yeah. And sometimes when like people's trauma is triggered during a tattoo, they can associate that trauma then with the tattoo that they have to look at on the skin every day and that it can really like compact the trauma for them. And [00:39:00] like we have, even though tattooing is not essential, so to speak, we do have a much more important role in people's lives than we realize and we have a lot more responsibility to to be cautious with how we treat people and to be more considerate and empathetic.
Anka: [00:39:21] Yeah, absolutely. It is. I don't know. You know, for me, it's, I take it as a huge responsibility because you are with the person in a very vulnerable moment for one reason or another. And that's why I think it's so damaging and toxic to just perpetuate this culture where like, just suck it up. Just lay there, you know, just shut up and sit there. Who needs this? We all have enough trauma already. Like we don't need more.
Eddy: [00:39:55] Absolutely.
Anka: [00:39:55] We dont need to be paying for an experience that's going to traumatize us.
[00:40:00] Eddy: [00:40:00] And there's lots of little things we can do to help our client have a better experience. Like I, I play music that's got like a softer beat, so that brings the heart rate down a bit, you know, keep them hydrated, you know, do everything I can to relax their body, offer them more pillows, you know, like,
Anka: [00:40:18] Yeah, absolutely.
Eddy: [00:40:20] If we're not always able to be there emotionally for our customers, like it makes sense to them. That way we can still do other things to make their experience better
Anka: [00:40:31] I always feel so happy when people say like, wow, like your space is so welcoming and they, I just feel so relieved like to me it's the biggest compliment because I get really uncomfortable where it's like crazy music blasting and like everyone's just like screaming on top of their lungs. Like I have like really shot nervous system after like so many years working in nightlife, so everything that's [00:41:00] like really, like, I can't even go to the shows anymore because it's just like, it honestly scares me and theyre not always the best environment. Yeah. I'm like so hypersensitive to everything that's like, I need it to be a serene environment.
Eddy: [00:41:23] You can, you can tell that the minute you walk into Black Iris, like it's so warm and welcoming, like the plants everywhere, the artwork, like on the walls, on the floor even the whole environment is like, I felt instantly comfortable there. And like when I arrived in New York, we'd had a hell of a time getting there driving from, um, Salem. We got stuck in a snowstorm. We were having the worst time and we rocked up to get tattooed at Black iris before my guest spot. But, and we will like on the verge of what felt like a breakdown. Like we just wanted to cry. [00:42:00] And then we got there. And I think if we hadn't had that experience in the studio and felt so safe and comfortable. I think it would have changed our entire holiday in New York.
Anka: [00:42:10] That means a lot
Eddy: [00:42:12] Yeah, it was. It's honestly one of the most incredible studios I've ever been in.
Anka: [00:42:16] Thank you. Johno and I like really put a lot of thought into how the space should be, and I think because we do a lot of community events, like I think that contributes to just like the general feel of it. Uh, cause that is like hands down my favorite thing about the studio, just having classes and events and meditation circles and you know, even people who don't want to get tattoos, like they can participate and they can be a part of the space. And um, it, like the community that it created is absolutely [00:43:00] incredible.
Eddy: [00:43:00] Yeah, and I mean community is really so much more important than I think we grew up realizing like in capitalist countries like the US and Australia with very individualistic, but when you kind of figure out how important community is, and you start to create one and create one in such a positive way, like you guys have, like what that does, not just for yourself, but for everyone around you is invaluable.
Anka: [00:43:28] I really think like, honestly, this is the only thing that like truly matters, because I'm like, this is the only thing that you can contribute to as like a regular person, not like a billionaire and see immediate result, like coming back to you. And that will like encourage you to, to put more effort into your community because you know, like, we feel so helpless by reading the news, everything is like, like we're all [00:44:00] attacked with these like huge problems that just make us feel paralyzed and make us feel helpless. And you know, you're like, I'm just a little guy like how can I, and it makes me think of Lord Of The Rings. It's like how can I stand in the face of the great evil like I'm nothing I'm a spec.
But when you make a change in your community or you know, you contribute in some way, where. People say that like, wow, this really helped me. Or, you know, it really changed my perspective. Or, you know, I just feel like I have a place to go to now. Like we had a person who said like, I just moved here and I don't know anyone. They felt really depressed. But now we can just come to these events and feel like I have friends and you know, I feel like home. So and I was [00:45:00] like ahh youre going to make me cry
Eddy: [00:45:02] I feel like thats success for me.
Anka: [00:45:06] It's powerful
Eddy: [00:45:06] That's a marker of success when you've like been able to have a positive impact on someone else's life. That's just, that's the greatest thing we can ever hope to do.
Anka: [00:45:16] It's true. And it's not like. Instagram followers or you know, like, of course, you know, it's a great tool to use as a way to reach more people and make contacts. And, but when you, when you put so much value in it, like it's, it doesn't mean anything. You need to nurture the real connections. And until I'm saying this to myself, first and foremost, you know, I'm not trying to preach like I'm still figuring this out for myself. Like don't put your energy in there. Like I'm obviously grateful for [00:46:00] that aspect and that I have a platform, but the only thing that really matters is people that are around you.
Eddy: [00:46:10] Yeah, absolutely.
Anka: [00:46:14] Yeah. You know what I mean?
Eddy: [00:46:16] Yeah. And we're so lucky to have that, like to have those people who, who do reach out and who do get involved and who do participate like, yeah. It just, it's a sad world when you see people who, who don't realize what they've got around them or who don't have respect or gratitude for it. Yeah, we are very lucky.
Anka: [00:46:41] Super lucky. I still, I can't believe it, you know, like where I came from and my life now, it's like, Whoa. You know, my parents came to visit me three times now and they were just like, you know, they were like, you have a space [00:47:00] in New York like crazy. And. Yeah. It's like when I look at Google maps and I see it, I'm still like,
Eddy: [00:47:12] That's so amazing.
Anka: [00:47:14] It's such an amazing experience,but I feel like, you know, like I got. I got the, like my dream came true, hands down like better than I could ever imagine. And, but I feel like I serve the space. Like this space is not for me to just be like, you know, be power tripping or walking around thing like I'm a business owner or whatever. It's like. I have like two needs, a sacred space and like I'm there to take care of the space and I'm there to like watch our artists grow and [00:48:00] be able to like facilitate these workshops.
Eddy: [00:48:03] You're a custodian rather than an owner.
Anka: [00:48:07] Yeah. Yeah.
Eddy: [00:48:08] That's fantastic
Anka: [00:48:09] It's an amazing experience. I will always be forever grateful for it.
Eddy: [00:48:16] Yeah. Do you guys have like, like you and Johno have any like kind of ideas or plans on how you're going to move forward, like after all of the madness has settled?
Anka: [00:48:29] I'm not sure yet because we're kind of like taking it month by month. Like, you know, we're still paying the rent and basically just like paying it up with our own money.
Eddy: [00:48:41] Wow.
Anka: [00:48:41] So, yeah, but you know, it's really hard to say, cause we just don't know how long this is gonna last and from what I understand, New York put tattoo shops in like [00:49:00] phase four reopening. So there is one is going to happen on May 15th so it might still be a while. Yeah, so like it's kind of like a time of where we just have to sit and wait and see what happens. But I really, I, I have confidence that we can pull through.
Eddy: [00:49:24] Yeah, absolutely. And I think, you know, sometimes when it does get hard and you reach out to the community, they will be there to help you get through if it comes to that anyway.
Anka: [00:49:36] Right. Yeah. But you know, at the same time. I just got to, I was like freaking out for so long and now I just kinda got to the point where I'm like, you know, whatever happens, happens. If we can't keep the business in this space, we'll just start in a new space. Like, you know, we have the [00:50:00] community, so
Eddy: [00:50:00] Absolutely, and you'll, you'll adapt.
You've adapted a million times before.
Anka: [00:50:07] For sure
Eddy: [00:50:10] Oh, that's so cool. Well, I might wrap it up there, but like it's been so amazing to speak to you and hear your story and I always, I really love your approach to tattooing and your studio and your clients. It's always a joy to see on social media and when I've got to talk to you as well.
Anka: [00:50:31] I think it's just like, I don't know if we still have time, but I really, really, really do think that we have to all approach it from, from like the, the real place, you know, not just to seem cool on the internet or for money. It's, it has to, it has to come from the right place because you, you are changing people's bodies [00:51:00] forever. Like that's a great responsibility. I don't know. I feel like we all have to remind that to ourselves all the time.
Eddy: [00:51:12] Yeah, definitely, absolutely. Well, um, this footage will be on YouTube for our listeners to watch later. So, um like for all of our listeners, you can head over to YouTube. Um, I'll put all of the like information, like how to find Anka and Black Iris in the show notes. Um, you can follow our Instagram. Uh, not just a girl underscore tattoo. Um. You know, please subscribe, follow, and share. Um, you know, let's spread the love for tattooing and for the amazing artists that we get to speak to.
Um, thank you so much, Anka, it's been so, so amazing talking to you and thank you to everyone who listened. Um, we really, really [00:52:00] appreciate it. Um, we hope you have a wonderful day and be kind to each other.
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